New to Honda was looking for some advice. - Page 2 - HondaClub.com

**MugenEJ6AutoX** · 05-07-2008, 08:41 AM

ps, the d16y8 is a very light engine as well.

**8695Beaters** · 05-07-2008, 10:54 AM

The B16 is also light. But look at all the mods your car has on it. A ported head is a couple thousand dollars right away. And the B16 makes more power than that stock. Any engine can have lots of torque, you just have to tune it right. Everyone tunes Hondas to make lots of high-revving power, which is what Hondas are good at doing. It's easy to get their power on the high-end of the RPM scale. Most people take the lazy way for torque and do a turbo. The B16 is also a direct fit into his car and because it is DOHC has way more potential. It all depends on what your needs are. If this guy had a lot of money and time, I would say go straight for a K24. But he doesn't, so a B16 is easier. Engine swaps are a good thing, but should be done smartly. That shouldn't be the knee-jerk reaction to more power, because it's not always the smartest move. I think in this case it is.

**MugenEJ6AutoX** · 05-07-2008, 12:29 PM

True, but judging by most beginner tuners driving habits....he'll prob blow a dohc v-tec. That and since he can't do the swap himself he'll be out even more cash. I think working his stock motor is a better route to go, and with the price of honda engines going through the roof lately....it may be the cheaper alternative. Also the D16y8 has a decently high rev limit to make use of that v-tec. No matter what he does it isn't cheap. Prepare to part with a few thousand out of pocket kid, a Mcdonalds paycheck ain't gonna cover it.

**8695Beaters** · 05-08-2008, 06:09 PM

It will if you save up. Although he never said he couldn't do it himself.

The beginners I have seen aren't anywhere near as hard on their cars as I am. Maybe that's just the guys I hang out with though. And while I have never seen anyone blow a stock B16 before, I have no doubt it can be done.

Hey the car can fit a B16. It would be stupid not to take advantage of that at some point. and better early than late since you will have to buy a bunch of new parts to fit the B anyway.

**MugenEJ6AutoX** · 05-08-2008, 07:51 PM

True, but it'd be nice to not be the only D-series tuner on this site. I mean I have a NA d16y8 v-tec that makes 150whp, and is built for turbo. When I'm done it will have 300whp and insane amounts of torque for such alittle car. And its a very light set-up. Just saying a b-series isn't the catch all answer for honda tuners. Should let them explore their options.

**8695Beaters** · 05-08-2008, 09:20 PM

The way I see it is you are going to go through all the work to swap in a new head or a new engine, why not spring for the best? The D is a great little engine and there are tons out there, and with the right parts a D16 can definetely turn some heads. In this case, I just don't see it as the right answer. And like I already said, to build an engine like yours, you would be paying way more than you would for a B16. And the stock B16 makes the same power as your modded D16. Bang for the buck, I would pick the B16. In an older Civic, I would probably stick with a D16. But this car can take a B16 so easily, it would truly be foolish not do a B-swap. Do an LS/VTEC to keep the cost down. That will still make more power than a D.

I read an article about a year ago in SCC. They tested two EG hatches, one with a B18C1 and one with a K20A2. Both had about the same amount of money invested and had similarly built chassis. The K20 was a nearly stock engine, while the B18 had nearly every bolt-on installed. And the K20 made more power. And was a better street car. Ignoring the 0.2 liters advantage over the B18, the K20 also had about 10 years of engineering advancements under its valve covers. The point is even though the D16 is the same displacement as the B16, the fact that the B16 was designed well after the D16 means that has more advances in design that improve flow and therefore power. The B or K-Series engines may not always be the perfect swap or the right answer, but I really see no reason why they aren't here. Okay building a D would spread out the cost, but in the end, if you just save up for the B, you will have a much better car to work on.

You aren't the only D-tuner here. Fire Optikz's Civic has a D15 if I remember correctly. So does marcos. And my CRX will probably get a D16 if I find the right one (I need to see if the current D15 is right for rallying). There are more out there if you keep looking too. I understand being faithful to an engine (right now my personal favorite would be the SR20DET), but sometimes there are better options out there.

**MugenEJ6AutoX** · 05-09-2008, 08:33 AM

I agree, and i'll admit im not an expert at this. Just a kid in school like half the people on this site. The best bang for your buck is a b16/b18. But I'll stick by my Sohc. Take pride, their all Hondas.

05-07-2008, 10:54 AM	#12 (permalink)
8695Beaters Geek In Training Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 1,235	The B16 is also light. But look at all the mods your car has on it. A ported head is a couple thousand dollars right away. And the B16 makes more power than that stock. Any engine can have lots of torque, you just have to tune it right. Everyone tunes Hondas to make lots of high-revving power, which is what Hondas are good at doing. It's easy to get their power on the high-end of the RPM scale. Most people take the lazy way for torque and do a turbo. The B16 is also a direct fit into his car and because it is DOHC has way more potential. It all depends on what your needs are. If this guy had a lot of money and time, I would say go straight for a K24. But he doesn't, so a B16 is easier. Engine swaps are a good thing, but should be done smartly. That shouldn't be the knee-jerk reaction to more power, because it's not always the smartest move. I think in this case it is. __________________ "I really like going fast. Just go off and meditate in the wind, you know? As corny as it sounds it works and feels good. It's a good way to just let the weight of the world off every once in a while...is this a big pose? I mean, yes this is a pose! I mean am I driving down the street to not get noticed in this thing? I mean rebellious is what this thing is I would say!!!" -James Hetfield

05-08-2008, 06:09 PM	#14 (permalink)
8695Beaters Geek In Training Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 1,235	It will if you save up. Although he never said he couldn't do it himself. The beginners I have seen aren't anywhere near as hard on their cars as I am. Maybe that's just the guys I hang out with though. And while I have never seen anyone blow a stock B16 before, I have no doubt it can be done. Hey the car can fit a B16. It would be stupid not to take advantage of that at some point. and better early than late since you will have to buy a bunch of new parts to fit the B anyway. __________________ "I really like going fast. Just go off and meditate in the wind, you know? As corny as it sounds it works and feels good. It's a good way to just let the weight of the world off every once in a while...is this a big pose? I mean, yes this is a pose! I mean am I driving down the street to not get noticed in this thing? I mean rebellious is what this thing is I would say!!!" -James Hetfield

05-08-2008, 09:20 PM	#16 (permalink)
8695Beaters Geek In Training Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 1,235	The way I see it is you are going to go through all the work to swap in a new head or a new engine, why not spring for the best? The D is a great little engine and there are tons out there, and with the right parts a D16 can definetely turn some heads. In this case, I just don't see it as the right answer. And like I already said, to build an engine like yours, you would be paying way more than you would for a B16. And the stock B16 makes the same power as your modded D16. Bang for the buck, I would pick the B16. In an older Civic, I would probably stick with a D16. But this car can take a B16 so easily, it would truly be foolish not do a B-swap. Do an LS/VTEC to keep the cost down. That will still make more power than a D. I read an article about a year ago in SCC. They tested two EG hatches, one with a B18C1 and one with a K20A2. Both had about the same amount of money invested and had similarly built chassis. The K20 was a nearly stock engine, while the B18 had nearly every bolt-on installed. And the K20 made more power. And was a better street car. Ignoring the 0.2 liters advantage over the B18, the K20 also had about 10 years of engineering advancements under its valve covers. The point is even though the D16 is the same displacement as the B16, the fact that the B16 was designed well after the D16 means that has more advances in design that improve flow and therefore power. The B or K-Series engines may not always be the perfect swap or the right answer, but I really see no reason why they aren't here. Okay building a D would spread out the cost, but in the end, if you just save up for the B, you will have a much better car to work on. You aren't the only D-tuner here. Fire Optikz's Civic has a D15 if I remember correctly. So does marcos. And my CRX will probably get a D16 if I find the right one (I need to see if the current D15 is right for rallying). There are more out there if you keep looking too. I understand being faithful to an engine (right now my personal favorite would be the SR20DET), but sometimes there are better options out there. __________________ "I really like going fast. Just go off and meditate in the wind, you know? As corny as it sounds it works and feels good. It's a good way to just let the weight of the world off every once in a while...is this a big pose? I mean, yes this is a pose! I mean am I driving down the street to not get noticed in this thing? I mean rebellious is what this thing is I would say!!!" -James Hetfield

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05-07-2008, 08:41 AM	#11 (permalink)
MugenEJ6AutoX Honda's are addicting Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 177	ps, the d16y8 is a very light engine as well.

05-07-2008, 12:29 PM	#13 (permalink)
MugenEJ6AutoX Honda's are addicting Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 177	True, but judging by most beginner tuners driving habits....he'll prob blow a dohc v-tec. That and since he can't do the swap himself he'll be out even more cash. I think working his stock motor is a better route to go, and with the price of honda engines going through the roof lately....it may be the cheaper alternative. Also the D16y8 has a decently high rev limit to make use of that v-tec. No matter what he does it isn't cheap. Prepare to part with a few thousand out of pocket kid, a Mcdonalds paycheck ain't gonna cover it.

05-08-2008, 07:51 PM	#15 (permalink)
MugenEJ6AutoX Honda's are addicting Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 177	True, but it'd be nice to not be the only D-series tuner on this site. I mean I have a NA d16y8 v-tec that makes 150whp, and is built for turbo. When I'm done it will have 300whp and insane amounts of torque for such alittle car. And its a very light set-up. Just saying a b-series isn't the catch all answer for honda tuners. Should let them explore their options.

05-09-2008, 08:33 AM	#17 (permalink)
MugenEJ6AutoX Honda's are addicting Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 177	I agree, and i'll admit im not an expert at this. Just a kid in school like half the people on this site. The best bang for your buck is a b16/b18. But I'll stick by my Sohc. Take pride, their all Hondas.